Methadone: A Flicker Of Light In The Dark

Methadone: A Flicker Of Light In The Dark

To provide a better understanding of the very important role methadone plays in the treatment of addiction.
 
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 Am I the only one who has this problem

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cj

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PostSubject: Am I the only one who has this problem   Tue Feb 02, 2010 2:13 pm

I have a question.... Has anyone EVER had a problem getting your correct amount of methadone when the nurses administer it? I have ran into this problem over and over again at my clinic in the past and now for the past month it has been an every day thing. I don't know whether the pump that they use to measure the methadone is the problem or the pumper. I am soooo frustrated because I have tried to communicate this to the nurse and the response I get is "your the only one who says that" - she doesn't ask any questions or offer any solutions. I have asked her to measure my dose with a syringe but she can't/won't go out of her way to do this for me. This is the only problem I have with my clinic: in fact, other than this MAJOR problem, I am very satisfied with the clinic here. The reason I am 100% sure that something is wrong with the pump is because: 1) I always look at the amount of methadone thats in the cup BEFORE they add the water to it. And the difference between the correct amount and not is when it's correct there is about one third an inch of methadone and when it's wrong there about one third of that in the cup. 2) I feel sick: withdrawls a few hours after dosing,( weak, body aches, stomach problems, runny nose and yawning) I have requested an increase, but been denied and I don't know what to do. I know it's not all in my head because I can see with own two eyes the difference in amounts. Like I said, there have been nurses in the past who have done this... but not as consistent as now. I had one nurse who always dosed me the correct amount. She happened to be there for the nine months during my pregnancy and I believe she saved me much stress and sickness throughtout my pregnancy - she was a true earth angel. Anyway, I am so frustrated and I don't know what to do about this problem. Can anybody offer me any suggestions or tell me what you think? Has anybody ever had this problem or am I crazy? thanks , cj
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:51 pm

Hello CJ,
Thanks for sharing your experience with us. I have never been to a clinic that uses the machine. The three clinics I have gone to all use tablets that they showed me before they added the water to it. So I don't have much experience with the dosing machine.

I am sure you have done this, but you said you can "see" a difference in the amount of methadone that is in the bottom of the cup, have you pointed it out to the nurse before you drank it and made her acknowledge the difference?

For those of us who aren't familiar w/the machine, can you tell us how exactly it works? Is it a liquid amount that the machine dispenses or is it pills that have to be wet down, how does it work?


RuthAnn
aka lilgirllost

We are not bad people trying to become good, we are sick people trying to become well.

Methadone; A Flicker Of Light In The Dark
www.medicalassistedtreatment.org
www.suboxoneassistedtreatment.org
We are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
If you cannot afford to call us, send us an email and
we will call you at our expense.
Office: 1-770-334-3655~ Cell: 1-770-527-9119
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cj

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PostSubject: THANKS, RUTHANN   Thu Feb 04, 2010 8:44 pm

I wanted to say thank you Ruthann for responding to my story and also to my "am I the only one w/this problem". I was excited to actually have somebody to talk to about it but scared at the same time. I didn't know if I would get a response at all and what the response would be, but you really made me feel comfortable, so thank you! I haven't had a lot of time to write back because I have a 15 month old who is constantly on the move so I am always busy w/him! The clinic I go to doses red liquid methadone. They have a pump machine in which the manually set to your dose. It's not electronic like some of the pumps I've heard of, It's an old fashioned manual machine. Depending on whose working, you either get your full prescribed dose or not and lately I don't know what they do to the pump but it has been shorting me. I"m sooo frustrated because nobody else will say anything to the nurses about it and I've talked to a few people who say they don't think their dose is always right. I wish they would say something. I'm at the point where I dont know what to do about it. It makes me sick physically and mentally to where I can't function if my dose is short. I have asked the nurse to measure my dose w/a syringe instead of the pump but she didn't. I don't think she understands how serious I am about it. Anyway I wanted to say thank you and I'm glad I have somebody to talk to now! I hope to hear from you soon
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Thu Feb 04, 2010 9:08 pm

Cj,
You don't have to thank me, that is what I am here for and I am so glad I at least can give you some encouragement.

It is VERY frustrating when others will sit there and agree with you that something isn't right, but then they won't step up and SAY something about it to the ppl that need to hear it. That is one of the things we hope to change in the future with the website and the forum is getting people to stop being so scared to speak OUT when they are being treated wrong or unfairly.

I understand what it is like to have little ones at home too. Mine are 10 & 9 now but at one time they were both that young and it was all I could do to keep from pulling my hair out sometimes!

In your original post you said " The reason I am 100% sure that something is wrong with the pump is because: 1) I always look at the amount of methadone thats in the cup BEFORE they add the water to it. And the difference between the correct amount and not is when it's correct there is about one third an inch of methadone and when it's wrong there about one third of that in the cup." If they are giving you the red liquid, how is it that there is methadone in the cup and what is the deal with the "before they add water". I thought it was already liquid and you couldn't "see" any methadone in it. Like when they give the diskettes and then wet them down, if you let them sit for a bit, you can see the methadone in the bottom of the cup. Or do they add water to the liquid that they get out of the machine? Can you explain that part to me?

You also didn't mention, have you pointed out the medicine in the bottom of the cup to the med nurse? If not, I would make sure and say something to her and have her ACKNOWLEDGE the amount in the bottom of the cup and then the next time you come in, have her look at it again and acknowledge if it is the same of different and ESPECIALLY if you see it is different.

Have you mentioned this to your counselor and/or the doctor? What about another nurse? Is there another one you could talk to and/or request that one dose you?

It is said to say, but again, alot of times the nurses and even the docs that are working and/or owning these clinics don't even believe in what they are doing and/or they don't care if you are having problems or not. It makes me crazy because if you don't believe in something than why DO IT??

You said you asked for an increase but they denied you, what was the "reason" for denying it? If you are having visible signs of withdrawals and not just cravings then they should see that you are in withdrawals. What about requesting a peak and trough? You could ask them if you had one done would they consider an increase based on the results. Course, half the time they don't know how to interpret the results anyway! I had my own horrible experience with THAT!

I will go for now. I am glad that you at least felt some encouragement and know that we are here for you. You can private message me through this forum or
If you want to email me personally at [url=mailto://boandtrent@cebridge.net]boandtrent@cebridge.net[/url] and I will be here for you in any way I can.


RuthAnn
aka lilgirllost

We are not bad people trying to become good, we are sick people trying to become well.

Methadone; A Flicker Of Light In The Dark
www.medicalassistedtreatment.org
www.suboxoneassistedtreatment.org
We are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
If you cannot afford to call us, send us an email and
we will call you at our expense.
Office: 1-770-334-3655~ Cell: 1-770-527-9119
Email: mrdeanv@aol.com
ALL INFORMATION IS KEPT STRICKLY CONFIDENTIAL
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cj

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Registration date : 2010-01-28

PostSubject: ruthann   Mon Feb 08, 2010 8:19 pm

Sorry I haven't posted my reply, I'm so busy w/my baby and also when my dose is short it's hard for me to function period. The way our clinic doses work is there is a pump machine and the nurses get a bottle of methadone (the bottle holds about a liter or two of methadone) and they connect the bottle to the pump. They then get a little dosing cup and set the pump manually its like a twisty metal piece that they set which goes up to 100 mg or ml. So for me, my dose is 143 (I dont know if its ml or mg) but anyway they set the pump first on 100 -then they pull the pump up to the top until it stops then they push it down and when they push down on it the red methadone dispenses- then they set it to 43mg and pull it up and push down to dispense. What's left is your measured liquid methadone in the cup but then they first add water to it-(I think so it does't taste so strong) before handing it to you. And for whatever reason the pump hasnt been measuring correct. I think it might be when they set it up for dispensing in the morning if they rig it just right it shorts me. I have said something to my counselor about it but her suggestion was to not look at it before they add the water. Well, that does no good because whether I see it or not I always know when its wrong because of the way I FEEL! I have also said something to the full time nurse and she says the reason I don't feel like it's right is because I'm under stress because I was late doing a u.a. and got knocked down a phase level and was having to go in 4 times a week instead of once. I told her the only reason I don't think it's because of "stress" is because of the amount thats in the cup.( It's about one third of what it should be) when it's short. I've asked her to measure my dose with a syringe instead of the pump but she said " it's NOT the pump" However, there is no doubt in my mind that it's wrong!!! Unless stress messes with my eyesight too- I don't see how she can give me that excuse! I'm at the point where I want to call the director and have her come check the pump or the pumper! But last Thursday when I went in the part time nurse did measure it correct so I had 3 days of take homes where I felt good and normal and could function but today when I went in to get dosed it was back to measuring short!! And I'm back to getting my weekly takehomes so now, my whole week is going to suck!! Thats pretty sad when they have the ability to either make or break my day for me. I don't know what to do. I don't want the nurses to hold it against me now if I go above them to try and get this problem fixed. I thought about writing a letter to the head nurse and really explain how I feel and ask if she will please measure my doses with the syringe. What do you think I should do????? I can't take living like this anymore and I want this simple problem fixed. P.S. The reason I was denied an increase is because my dose is at 143mg already. They said I can have a peak and trough but that costs like $100.00 and I don't have it right now!
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Mon Feb 08, 2010 10:47 pm

Wow. Cj I am so sorry you are having to deal with that. thanks by the way for explaining how the pump thing works, I have never seen one and when I tried to do research all they had were current fancy pumps, probably not like the one you have at your clinic!

It IS NOT in your head and I can't believe that was the solution the counselor gave you! "just don't look at it!" PLEASE!

I know you don't want to make the head nurse upset with you, but maybe try talking to her once more, As calmly as possible(even though I know it's hard since you are going through w/drawals and it feels like she doesn't care and/or doesn't want to help you and I KNOW what that feels like......you just want to scream at them!) Anyhow! Try telling her once more about how things went when the other nurse dosed you and again telling her it is not in your head because you see the amt of meds in the cup before they add water and there is a difference. Tell her that you aren't trying to cause her problems but if she still refuses to check the pump and/or refuse to measure w/a syringe that you are going to ask the director to please check the pump. Maybe if you tell her that up front, then she will either take you seriously and start measuring your dose properly (or w/a syringe) and if she doesn't, then you can get the director up there to check it out. You shouldn't have to suffer! You are suppose to get your appropriate amt of methadone and if you think for any reason that you are not, I wouldn't just let it go.

Something else I would do before you contact the director is to start keeping a diary or a log (if you can remember the important info from the last week or so when you had the experience w/the other med nurse and noticed the difference, I would DEFINATELY put that in there too!) but start keeping a log of the days you notice the cup in short of methadone and what time you start feeling the w/drawals. Then on the days when the other nurse does it, you can show the difference and you have something to back up what you are saying and show them that you are serious about what is going on.

Do you think that is something you might could do?

Does she measure anyone else w/a syringe?

It is expensive to have a peak and trough, and like I said before, most of the time they don't even know how to accurately READ one! but if you are having w/drawals it should show up on the peak and trough and that gives you more ammo for your situation in case you DO have to go over their heads.

Hang in there and please keep us posted on what happens and what you decide to do.


RuthAnn
aka lilgirllost

We are not bad people trying to become good, we are sick people trying to become well.

Methadone; A Flicker Of Light In The Dark
www.medicalassistedtreatment.org
www.suboxoneassistedtreatment.org
We are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
If you cannot afford to call us, send us an email and
we will call you at our expense.
Office: 1-770-334-3655~ Cell: 1-770-527-9119
Email: mrdeanv@aol.com
ALL INFORMATION IS KEPT STRICKLY CONFIDENTIAL
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cj

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PostSubject: RuthAnn   Sat Feb 13, 2010 4:39 pm

Hi, RuthAnn. sorry It takes me so long to post my replies. I have been so busy lately with the baby and everything! Thank you so much for your advice, I am going to talk to the full time nurse one more time before I go above her. My take home doses did seem a little better this week so I don't know if I'm going to wait and see how they are next week or I was thinking about switching the day I go to pick up my takeouts to make it so the part time nurse fills them. The only thing that I worry about is she has not always measured right either. She did measure correctly when she first started working there and then all of the sudden about a month and a half ago all three of the nurses started measuring short. I think the head nurse showed them how she sets up the pump and told them to set it up like she does. But for some reason the last time the part time nurse dosed me she didnt short me so I'm thinking I might take a chance and switch days. I don't know I just want to get my full prescribed dose- thats all I'm asking. I can't believe I'm even having this problem. I KNOW when it's right and when it's short. The difference is like night and day. They did measure our doses with a syringe for a couple days about 2 months ago because the pump broke and they were waiting for the new one to be delivered and when they measured that way my doses were right. I just hope they'll take a couple extra minutes for me and measure mine that way- that would solve the problem for me. If I'm the only one who has said anything then I'll be the only one they'll have to take more time to measure differently. It would make all the difference in the world to me. This past month and a half has been terrible. I have been so sick, unstable, stressed, weak,mad and sad over all of this it just makes me ill. Anyway thanks for listening and thanks for your advice - it means a lot to me!!! I'll let you know what happens on Monday! Wish me luck
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cj

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PostSubject: Ruthann   Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:31 pm

Oh my gosh I am so frustrated; When I went to the clinic on Monday I was prepared to talk to the f/t nurse about my issue again. When I got there first there was quite a few people waiting for the nurse - she had got to the clinic but forgot the key so she went back to her house to get it so when she got back there was like 15 of us waiting then but it wasn't the f/t nurse it was the part time nurse (the one who dosed me right last week) so I thought great I hope to God she'll dose me correctly again today! Well, she DIDN'T. I just wanted to scream but of course me having no backbone I said nothing. She was really frazzled because she was running late and there were people behind me who had to get to work in a hurry so I drank me incorrect dose got my weekly takeouts and left. (She also had my takeouts prefilled by her) so now my whole week is going to miserable. Today I fell aweful and I have so much to do, I just hope next week is better. I hope next week I will speak up for myself and I PRAY the nurse will listen and HELP. How are you felling since you got an increase? I read some of your old posts and I swear it's almost like hearing myself!! I wanted to ask you how many hours do you wait after getting dosed to take the peak and trough? Because my dose usually (depending on if it's measured correctly anyway) only lasts until about 5:00 pm. and I take my dose between 6:00 and 7:00 am. so I'm thinking it would really make a difference depending on what time of day you take the test. Hope all is well - thanks for listening! cj
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PostSubject: dose not correct   Thu Feb 18, 2010 6:31 pm

Hi, at the clinic I go to they pump the methadone from a 1 L bottle (1000ml). The concentration of the liquid in the bottle is 10 mg/ml. The pumping of the methadone is not done manually. The bottle of methadone cencentrate is hooked up to a little tube that goes thru a pump that is calibrated and controlled by a computer program. This method is extremely accurate and leaves no room for human error. In the case of a computer problem they can use a maunal pump. I have seen them do this and the manual pump is also very accurate, just a lot slower. I have used both pumps (copmputer and manual) in the labs I have worked in (Microbiology and DNA lab technician) and both are excellent at dispensing the correct dose. After the liquid is pumped into a little cup, it is handed to you and there are 2 water stations that are hooked up to purified water to dilute the concentrate. This helps to make it easier to drink and get all your methadone from your cup, I rinse it 2-3 times. I cannot understand how you keep getting the wrong amount. If this were happening it would not be only you who is getting the wrong dose. If you are serious, then, yes, you need to talk to your director. Our director is there every day of the week and runs our group on saturday. He has an open door policy and is always available to listen and help. If this is actually happening then the nurses are not doing their job properly and you should not put up with it. You deserve what you are there to get. Speak up for yourself. It is great to post here and get other peoples oppinion and see what others think, but it will not solve your problem at your clinic, only you can take action to make it happen. I hope all goes well for you, I really do! I cannot imagine not getting the correct dose, it is completely unacceptible, do NOT stand for mediocre treatment, you have rights!
Sometimes we have to fight for our rights!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Thu Feb 18, 2010 8:52 pm

Gee, if I didn't know better I would almost think you worked at the clinic rather than attending one. I appreciate your...interest but the way you came off to ME was a little defensive. It sounded like you don't believe that incorrect measuring is possible. Well I'm here to say that it is and does happen. I don't know if you have read all of my posts, because I did state that I have talked to other clients and I am NOT the only one who feels the doses are inaccurate however I am the only one who will say anything and stand up about it. Our director does not even work in the same building where the dosing takes place, in fact I did not even know WHO our director was until I asked a month ago and I've attended the clinic for 3 years. I wish we had as much contact as you do with your director. I appreciate your suggestions but being a methadone client yourself, maybe next time you post a reply try to be a little more supportive, empathetic and don't indirectly call someone a liar and not take them seriously, give them the benefit of the doubt.
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Thu Feb 18, 2010 10:46 pm

cj,

sorry it took me so long to answer, this is my week to work a long week and then I have two boys who have karate, cub scouts, soccer and tutorials that I have to run around playing chauffer (sp??) for. I am so tired right now I can hardly keep my eyes open!

Have you started keeping track/taking notes of the days you think you are short and/or your symptoms? If you are going to talk to your director, I would def have some type of documentation to back you up that shows you are serious about this and it isn't just you trying to get an increase just for the heck of it.

As for the peak and trough, I took my dose just like normal the day before ( I usually took it around 7am and I would start having w/d symptoms by 6 or 7 pm the same night so about 12 hrs later) I came in the next morning around 7AM (they wanted me there about the time I would normally dose) and then they took my blood. They dosed me and I had to wait 4 hours and come back and they took my blood again.

What they are wanting too see is your "trough" which is your lowest blood level, which naturally is going to be right before your next dose. Methadone hits it's "peak" about 4 hrs later, thus the blood test again 4 hrs after your dose.

They are wanting to see what each of those levels are AND if there is a big difference between the two levels. We have a post under this link http://methadone.forumotion.net/is-your-dose-holding-you-f4/how-to-interpret-a-peak-and-trough-test-t162.htm that tells you how to interpret a peak and trough. Bad thing is though, a lot of the clinic doctors and/or staff don't even know how to interpret one! As you can tell from my previous posts, my peak and trough was used AGAINST me to decrease my dose because they didn't know how to read it properly.

Bottom line, if you are having a problem getting your accurate dose, or you even think you are, they should be willing to do what they can to make you feel at ease and to check out your concern. Like I said before, if you haven't already, keep track of the dates, names of the nurses and any other important info, the days you think your dose was short, your symptoms that day etc. It is your sobriety on the line here, you can do it nicely without being a "problem" client.

Having said all that, you are the one that ultimately has the live w/the decision you make. If you do go over their heads and then they get upset w/you, you are the one that has to deal with the outcome. On the same token you are the one that has to deal with it if they are shorting your meds, unintentionally or intentionally so you have to decide how you want to deal with it and which is the best way to deal with it. Either way, we are here for you so hang in there and keep us posted.


RuthAnn
aka lilgirllost

We are not bad people trying to become good, we are sick people trying to become well.

Methadone; A Flicker Of Light In The Dark
www.medicalassistedtreatment.org
www.suboxoneassistedtreatment.org
We are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
If you cannot afford to call us, send us an email and
we will call you at our expense.
Office: 1-770-334-3655~ Cell: 1-770-527-9119
Email: mrdeanv@aol.com
ALL INFORMATION IS KEPT STRICKLY CONFIDENTIAL
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PostSubject: You are NOT the only one!!   Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:25 pm

I have been on several different clinics in NYC and Boston, MA. over the past 30 years and have run into this problem repeatedly. I actually got thrown off a clinic many years ago for not having any methadone in my urine test! I WAS taking the dose the nurse was giving me, but it turns out that she was stealing doses and that was discovered after I got tossed off. Unfortunately, clients are generally the ones who get blamed/and or disbelieved when something is questionable. I recently started a new clinic where they use the liquid. Before this, I had been at 100mg., on a clinic that uses the 40mg biscuits, for the past 18 years. In my case, there seems to be a vast difference between the biscuits and the liquid, and it's obvious in the fact that I no longer have any trouble with constipation. Anytime I've taken methadone this was a major issue for me, and now I'm functioning as if I have no methadone in my system at all. I also don't sleep like I used to when I was taking the biscuits, as I'm up and down all night these days. I've raised my dose to 110mg of the liquid, and it just doesn't seem to stay in my system for more than half the day. I have also questioned whether or not I am getting the dose they tell me I'm getting. Unlike the last clinic (ATCNE in Brighton MA.), this clinic (N. Charles in Somerville, MA) seems to be quite caring. So I'm having a hard time imagining that they would purposely deceive me. I'm feeling pretty hopeless lately. For 18 years things were good for me, and now I don't think I'll ever get back to my former life again. I guess I should just feel lucky that I had the 18 years! I'm getting very tired of feeling hopeless and depressed.
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Sun Feb 21, 2010 11:43 pm

cj tomorrow is Monday is that the day you usually pick up your take homes? How are you doing?
I know it is frustrating for you not knowing what to expect when you go into your clinic. Which nurse will be there, will it be one that will measure my dose correctly or will it be one that won't listen to you.
I have been following your posts and to Eb honest if it were me I know what I wold want to do, but like you I am not sure if I could. Part of me would want to talk to the director of the clinic and explain my situation in the hopes that they would stop and take the time to listen to me and see if there was something they could do to help. But another part of me would be hesitant to do anything because I wouldn't want to alienate the dosing nurse. (It has always been easier for me to stick up for others rather than myself.)
This is your decision and no one can make it for you. But I hate to see you suffer everyday knowing that you shouldn't have to. Do you know which days the director is going to be in your clinic? Perhaps you can find out and make it a point to go up to the clinic to see her. If you already have your take homes for that week and you see they are short take them with you had show them to her so she can see what you are talking about.
It is time for you to start enjoying the life you deserve. Good luck cj.
Thinking of you,
Dee


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cj

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PostSubject: keemo   Mon Feb 22, 2010 4:56 pm

Hi keemo! It was so nice to hear from you, thank you for taking the time to write me a post! I, like you have not been feeling good for the last 2 months. I remember when my dose was measured accurately, It was like almost having my life back to how it was before my addiction. But now my dose doesn't help much and the little relief I get only lasts for around 6-7 hours. I feel so physically exhausted (yet I can't sleep longer than an hour at a time), weak with body aches. And it seems like such a simple problem that should be fixable yet they just don't believe me and don't care. Well, the full time nurse anyway. I asked her today again if she would please measure my dose w/a syringe instead of the pump and she flat out said no. She told me to come in for a "staffing" tomorrow at 11:30am. I don't know what their going to tell me, I just hope there will be someone there who is compassionate and will help me. I wish all clinics would use the bisquits, from what I've read there is a huge difference between the liquid vs the bisquits. Pretty much everybody whose taken both prefers the bisquits. I hope that you start feeling better soon, you will be in my thoughts and prayers and I hope you keep me posted as to how your feeling! I will try and write you tomorrow after my staffing and tell you how that goes! Take Care! Luv, Cj
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cj

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PostSubject: Dee   Mon Feb 22, 2010 5:16 pm

Hi, Dee! I did go in today for my takeouts but I had such a bad week last week I called the clinic Saturday and asked them to wait to fill my takeouts. So today I go in and ask the full time nurse if I can talk to her. I told her I understand how it might be a pain and take a few extra minutes to fill my doses w/the syringe but I told her It would mean everything to me and make all the difference in the world to me. She flat out said no- she looked pissed off and was so rude about it. I asked her why there is a difference with the amount of methadone in the cup. she shrugged her shoulders and told me again "your the only one who says anything" I said well if I'm the only one who says anything then I'll be the only one you'll have to do this for. She said I'll dose you w/the syringe today and thats it- never again and I'm not going to fill your whole weeks take outs with the syringe. She suggested again that I put in for an increase. I told her I would put in for one and wait for the doctor today cause it's his day to come in. So I waited like 45 minutes with a screaming baby (She asked me not to let him down because there is stuff he could get into) and he was crying because he wanted down, so anyway when the doctor got there, instead of letting me talk to him she goes in the office shuts the door then comes out a few minutes later and said the doctor said no to my increase and they want me to come in tomorrow for a "staffing". I left and I was so mad-I don't know why I couldn't speak for myself. I asked if the doc would be at the staffing tomorrow & she said maybe. So I don't even know what to expect tomorrow. I feel like they don't care about me/my treatment. I called the director and told her what happened but she also said they don't dose w/the syringe. She said we will talk about it tomorrow so now I'm a little nervous I just want someone there to believe me and stand up for me and Help me. Oh and also when I finally went to get dosed they did have my takeouts prefilled when I asked them not to! Have you ever been to a staffing or do you know anyone who has? I dont know what to expect tomorrow. Any advice/suggestions would help a lot! Thanks for writing to me! I will let you know tomorrow what happens! Luv, Cj
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:45 pm

Oh my CJ ! I feel so sorry for you! I was just saying that I wish that I could get the liquid, but they do not have it at my clinic. I have been following your post, and I can not believe how rude the staff is at your clinic. I bet you are a nervous wreck! Try to go in tomorrow and hold your head high and stand for what you believe in. These clinics kill me acting like the medicine and increases is something off there back. What is it to them if you need and increase??? You will feel alot better, and things would go so much smoother, but they act like you are getting in their personnel savings account!!! I will pray for you and be thinking about you. Please let us know as soon as you get back, I will be waiting to here what happens. Wish I could go in with you and hold your hand!! Good Luck Regina
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Mon Feb 22, 2010 10:05 pm

I would look at the staffing as a chance to finally get to tell them what has been going on and to speak your mind. It might would've help if you had been able to keep a log or a diary of your symptoms and what has been going on so that you have something to show them instead of just going in there and trying to remember everything.

Have you also been having the nurse document your actual withdrawal symptoms? Each time you go in and were having them, you needed to have them document this in your chart....believe me! I know THIS from personal experience! I would talk to them about mine and they even acknowledged them, but when it come to trying to get my increase they were like "we have nothing verifying you were having actual w/drawal symptoms" so it hurt me in the long run to not have them document this each and every time we talked about it.

I do think you should make a list of the questions and concerns that you have so you can be sure and mention everything while you have everyone's ear.

I have never had a "staffing" or known anyone that has done one, but again, I can't help but think this is now your chance to speak to them all at one time and speak your mind about what has been going on.

Let us know what happens and good luck!
ruthann


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aka lilgirllost

We are not bad people trying to become good, we are sick people trying to become well.

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PostSubject: It sounds like we're in the exact same situation!   Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:11 pm

Hi CJ, I'm still new to this forum stuff, so I hope this message gets back to you. I'm sorry to hear that you're feeling the same symptoms as I am. I haven't felt this crappy since I was a teenager. I really feel like I'll never be back to where I was for so long, and I'm now basically waiting to die. I'm doing my best to fill my days with any type of busy work I can think of. Lately this has been working on huge looms, weaving seed beads. As you can imagine, this consumes many hours a day and helps keep my mind off my life. I've pretty much spent my life doing things that will keep my mind occupied, so I can ignore my reality. So, even though I'm still doing some kind of artwork, it doesn't have the level of passion my metalsmithing work had. I've surrounded myself with craft stuff, hoping that something might inspire me a little. Luckily I thought of this. I really hope you don't have to deal with a huge pile of sh*t at your meeting tomorrow. In my clinic experience...the squeaky wheel gets tossed out. Please, please be careful and tread lightly. These people know they can do just about anything they want to us without fear of reprisal. I'm very concerned for you. Believe me, I wish all clinics would use the biscuits too! Isn't it ironic that they're getting such a bad rap. I would think people would be more nervous about the liquid. It's MUCH easier to O.D. on that. Whenever anyone gets a hold of it, they swig off the bottle having no concept of how many milligrams they're taking. I have to say that I'm feeling very hopeless and very screwed. I'm still upset that the last clinic destroyed my life to this extent. I would love to turn that place upside down, but painfully, I don't really think there's anything I can do about it. They are free to treat us in any sadistic way they want. It's enough to make you sick...literally!! Good luck with your meeting. I'll be thinking of you and hoping things go your way, keemo
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cj

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PostSubject: Regina,Keemo,Dee and Ruthann   Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:38 pm

Hi guys, I just got back home from my staffing. It was pretty much a waste of my time and energy. I had all of my notes prepared with dates that I was sick, I even had a solution to my problem but just like I thought, nobody wanted to open up their mind and even consider the possibility that what I was saying is true. And I myself don't understand how their measurements can come out accurate at the end of the day since I know I'm not getting my full dose . I told them maybe it's just me I dont know, all I know is in my heart and in my mind I have no doubt that something is making it measure short. I mean, I can see the difference with my own two eyes, let alone feel the difference and if it wasn't such a big difference I wouldn't even have bothered saying anything in the first place. I dont go around trying to make trouble or start drama. It was hard for me to even stand up for myself. I was so nervous I went into the room with 5 of the staff, the doc. and the supervisors and they seat me at the head of the table. I basically told them consistently for the past two months my dose has been inaccurate. I told them It has happened in the past w/other nurses but not every day like it is happening now. I told them the dates that my dose was right. I said it would mean EVERYTHING to me and make all the difference in the world if the nurse could only measure my dose w/the syringe. That was my solution. To them, I guess it's too much to ask. They just simply won't do it for me. The ONLY suggestion they had was they want me to do a peak and trough which I said I would do except thats not going to make my dose accurate! They all looked at me like I was crazy the whole time and said its just "my way of thinking about it is not right" First they said there is no room for error w/the pump but at the end of the conversation they said of course its going to be a little inaccurate- a total contradiction. They basically said my eyes are deceiving me in not so many words. So now I not only have to come up w/payment for March but also payment for a darn peak and trough. I feel like I went in and stood up for myself all for nothing..... I'm just glad I have you guys to talk to, otherwise I dont know what I would do. Having you makes me feel so much better. I love you all and hope you are all doing good! I hope to talk to you soon-Luv,cj
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:33 pm

CJ I have waited all day to hear what they did! I am so sorry that it didnt work out like you wanted it to. Is there another clinic near that you could switch to? I dont know what else you can do. I hope the others can give you some better advice. I hope the peak and trough doesnt work against you, (like you dont have enough to worry about)! Thats the reason I am scared to ask for an increase. Good luck and keep us updated on the peak and trough! Regina
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Wed Feb 24, 2010 1:24 am

Hi cj, I am so sorry that things didn't turn out for you the way you had hoped. It took a lot of courage for you to walk into that meeting by yourself and face everyone like you did and I admire you for that.
I had hoped things would turn out in your favor. Maybe (I hope) the nurse will be more mindful when making up your dose the next time you have to go in. You are always welcome to come here and post when things get to be too much for you. Hopefully something will turn around and you will be able to afford the peak and trough soon.


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lilgirllost
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Humor : I don't have a sense of humor.............
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Wed Feb 24, 2010 10:48 am

cj,
I too am sorry things didn't go how you had hoped, it does show again though how the clinics always act like we don't know what we are talking about and treat us like we are drug seeking if we say we need an increase.

I agree w/Dee, you were brave to go in there and tell them what was going on with you and to speak out against what was going on.

The only options I see that are left for you is to stay w/the clinic and have your peak and trough (but I don't hold out much hope for that changing their minds either after my own experience with that!) or stay with them and just drop it. You could also file a complaint against them, but again, I see this causing you more problems than helping you or you could change clinics if that is a possibility.

No matter what you decide, we are here for you so please don't hesitate to let us know when you are struggling or need someone to talk to.

Hang in there!
RuthAnn


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We are not bad people trying to become good, we are sick people trying to become well.

Methadone; A Flicker Of Light In The Dark
www.medicalassistedtreatment.org
www.suboxoneassistedtreatment.org
We are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
If you cannot afford to call us, send us an email and
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PostSubject: Sorry CJ!   Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:10 pm

I'm actually surprised that you didn't end up in trouble for requesting a meeting. After all the years I've spent on clinics, I know a couple of things: 1) you have to follow their rules, and 2) you have to stay under their radar. I used to think that clinics were working WITH us (and in the beginning they were), but now I believe they are in place to police us and keep us under control and out of sight. So far, I like my new clinic quite a bit. They generally seem to want to help their clients. Unfortunately, I think this is not typical. I believe that most clinic staff can't wait to put the screws to their clients, as over time they grow to resent us. The burn-out rate for clinic staff (at least good and caring ones) is depressing. In my experience, everyone who goes into this business with their hearts in the right place...wanting to help people, learn very quickly that there is little they can do because MMT is strangled with regulations. So, they usually either stop working in this field, or get jaded and keep their distance. It also doesn't help that some of us consistently try to get away with breaking rules, misbehaving, and trying to "get-over". In any group of people there are always different types. Some of our "bad guys" are pretty seriously bad, so as a group we do have a reputation to deal with. Of course, this does not mean that we should ALL be lumped together as sleaze bags. At least I don't think so! Anyway CJ...like you, I do not trust the liquid dosing system. If I were you, I would buy a fine tip paint marker and ask the director (or whoever you find out you need to ask) if you can mark your dosing cup every day. I don't see why they wouldn't let you take the empty marked cup with you and leave them with your therapist (who hopefully you can trust) so you can compare the amounts. This is one way you could actually find out if your dose is really consistent. Now that I'm thinking about it, it would be a good idea if the clinics that use the liquid would use plastic dosing cups that have lines imprinted on them. Something like the little cups that come with NyQuil. They DO make those. I think this little effort would make a lot of MMT clients feel a lot better about the system in general. Ask at your clinic and see if they'll let you buy your own marked plastic cups if they don't want to get them. That shouldn't be a problem for them, and it would probably make you feel a lot better. What do you think? Later, keemo
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Thu Feb 25, 2010 2:18 pm

that sounds like a great idea to me but on the other hand you know how clinics are they are always in a hurry to get ppl through the lines so they don't take much extra special time for anything lol so who knows if they would let you do that or not....but it never hurts to ask especially if you truly don't think you are getting the right amount.
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Humor : I don't have a sense of humor.............
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PostSubject: Re: Am I the only one who has this problem   Thu Feb 25, 2010 3:36 pm

Yeah, I like Kim's idea too but I bet the clinic won't go for it. They are such sticklers for things like bringing in all empties and taking the cups we drink out of so I bet they would have a problem with that, plus it will take more "time".

I like the idea of marking the cup too, but again, unless they allow you to reuse the cup again, I don't see where this would work either.

They would REALLY have a fit if you brought your own syringe and sucked it into the syringe out of the cup so you could measure it right then and show it to them.

Also like Kim said, it is best if you can stay "under the radar" and now that you have actually challenged them, you need to be careful and make sure they don't start trying to make things more difficult since you stirred up some "trouble".

If possible, I would check into changing clinics. Let us know what you decided to do.

RuthAnn


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aka lilgirllost

We are not bad people trying to become good, we are sick people trying to become well.

Methadone; A Flicker Of Light In The Dark
www.medicalassistedtreatment.org
www.suboxoneassistedtreatment.org
We are available 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
If you cannot afford to call us, send us an email and
we will call you at our expense.
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